Ok, now I would like to have a civilized and intellectual discussion with one of the creators of this site.
I will not prove or disprove Zeitgeist, since truthfully It might not be 100% factual, but I do see at at 100% rationnal.
First off, I hope you do believe that the earth is more than 6000 years or so old. There has been evolution on this planet and so far, every branch of animals has had its time to rule this planet we call earth, from the simple cell organisms who gave us our atmosphere to the insects to the reptiles and now it is our time to shine, us the mammals. If you do believe in a personal god, one that listens to your prayers and has humans as his little pets and devotees, then you are just like a grown up kid that still believes in Santa clause in his late twenties.
The fact that many people believe in a personal god, doesn’t mean you should as well. I am aware that our generation (I am 23) and the ones after us seem to be atheist to be ‘’cool’’ with no other purpose, but it is not my case. IF there is a god, in whom I do imply in the fact that the creation of the universe and matter as it is, must have come from somewhere, I do not believe he intervenes in our lowly mortal affairs and does not listen to whiney little humans. On the other fact that if he does exist, he would not love his children (humans) he would probably dislike most of us, or all of us who classify ourselves as ‘’civilized’’. We who destroy this beautiful world with our destructive ways.
Other things to consider, why are there so many different religions in this world, if their truly is only one god. Why yours is the true one? Another thing, if he IS a ‘’GOD’’ (God is most often conceived of as the supernatural creator and overseer of the universe) why would he have such a human feeling as jealousy (thou shall only believe in one god). Such a poor mistake from a human created god.
How long have humans lived on this planet? Approx. 3 000 000 years. For the last 10 000 years we’ve been practicing agriculture, and we’ve been praying to Jesus for 2000 years. Why do humans believe themselves apart from animals? One basic fact, over the last 4 000 000 000 years of the planet’s history, many creatures have come to be and pass, while the brain kept evolving and getting more complex, until Humans, who’s brain is more complex then all others. What defines us is the fact that we, like no other creature on earth, can analyse information. We can see a footprint and know that if we follow this, eventually (theoretically), we should find the one to whom it belongs. No other animal can do this. With this brain power, comes the question long ago, what are we doing here? Who are we? Thus was born religion. With no science and knowledge it makes sense to believe in a God or gods.
The problem happens at this point, our brain power and our belief in a purpose and a God, made us believe we are higher than all life. We see ourselves not among the animals of this world and in consequence we no longer believe in the rules that apply to all forms of life. One basic fact of ecology is a population follows its source of food, one increases and so does the other, one decreases and so does the other. Another that applies is the law of conservation of mass. If we are slowly transforming all biomass to human mass, what happens when we run out of biomass which is the life support system of this planet?
The very fabric of Hierarchy and its creation among our society was born through religion. When the first among us began to say: “I am the voice or the emissary of God or the gods”. As societies became more complex, the birth of government was born, through the church. A form of control of the masses. Which is the very point of Zeitgeist and the point that seems to be missed.
It is hard to believe in a personal god when you gaze at the stars (stars are sun’s by the way) and believe we are the lucky ones in which God gave life. There are too many stars and therefore planets revolving in this universe to be the only ones, but we probably are few.
Another thing, with the laws that govern this universe, the law of gravity is truly a complex law that governs this universe. If it wasn’t for this law, written by a true God (a non personal creator of the UNIVERSE and not 7 day earth), earth would not be what it is. If the earth was smaller or bigger in mass, the composition of our atmosphere would differ because gravity on earth would either be stronger or weaker. Flight might not have been possible, maybe life outside the oceans would never have existed. What the message here is that we are lucky for the random conditions of earth to have develop life on it and to exist on this earth, but the thing is and the message that zeitgeist is throwing is a change in perception of our world, a new hope in order to actually possess a future for our kind and our planet. Vision is the flowing river, and our river is towards catastrophe.
If you are an avid reader, you should read Ishmael by Daniel Quinn. It is a mind and spirit journey that will change your perception on things, which is the entire point of Zeitgeist. Our world needs a new path, a new vision in order to survive this century.
I have plenty more information if you require so, the key to intellectual development is to have perceptions the more knowledge you gain the more perspective points you gain ( Points of view) with more perspective, you may thus see the two sides of the coin, and then debate the subject.

P.S. first off I am French; I hope the entire text is quite coherent. Secondly I have a double major in biology and geology along with extensive studies in Anthropology. Feel free to respond and discuss, thank you.

Too bad the majority of people have been ingrained with the deceiving notion to lead them to believe people like us are not only fucking nuts but that they shouldn't listen to us the moment after we contradict their "content" life_style_. With the efficiency we have now, not to mention what could be in store in the future, we could easily have a world where everyone could be provided for with at least moderate or better standards of living. If there had to be a limit on how many people there were on the planet to make sure that there was always enough to go around, I think most would more then likely give up their less then 2$ a day wages to live better. It's the people of the bourgeois class who assume that they were not only born better but should always deserve more then everyone else on this planet; instead of acknowledging we are all born the same with 0 logic and void of reason, we have to learn it.

Ced:
I am not one of the creators of this site, but after reading your post in this thread, I have some comments and questions for you.
First; when you refer to "beliefs" designed to control the masses, please explain which beliefs in which society were NOT ultimately designed to "control the masses"? That is, which beliefs can you find which do not tie into some sort of establishment dogma that has as its purpose the guiding of the common rabble toward ends desired by the society's leadership?
Secondly; are you aware that it really doesn't matter what the masses "believe"? Look at the condition of your own country after 30 years of Liberal/Marxist/Socialist/Globalist "beliefs" which were supposed to be modern and "enlightened"! Look at the rioting mobs of the animated garbage from the Third World, which your "enlightened" governments have allowed to enter and squat on French soil at the expense of the people of France! Can you explain the difference between what you see as negative in religious mythology and Socialist/Marxist/One-World mythology and dogma?....especially considering the very real and fast-approaching bloodshed and destruction of Western civilization FROM WITHIN due to human termites of the "Rainbow/Mono-culturalist" variety and their ever-active attempts to subvert every nation in every way. You mention a "New World", well I suggest that you take a good, long look at conditions in any large city within France and you'll soon see what sort of "New World" is coming! And I guarantee that this "New World" will be just as bad and horrible and the "Old World" was, if not a lot more so!
Third; you seem concerned about people believing in the world being 6000 years old, but what about people believing that "there is no such thing as 'race' - there is only the 'human race'"? What about people believing that finance and trade at the expense of the environment and necessities for life ( water, clean air, diverse eco systems, etc. ) are merely on this planet to be exploited? What about beliefs which say that this planet is an artifact and everything on it exists to "use"?
How concerned are you about the negatives _link_ed to these kinds of beliefs? And, which of the two ( religious mythological nonsense or present-day materialist mythological nonsense ) are worse and have the most potential for destruction?
Fourth; you mention human "brain power" associated with belief in "God", but what about human brain power associated with gross materialism or insane Marxist/Socialist/Globalist Rainbow dogma? Has there been any change at all in human brain power? Or have the dogmas just changed while the human mind BELIEVES just because leaders of one sort or another TELL THEM TO?
In addition; you are absolutely WRONG when you say that leadrship/hierarchy was born from religion. There are NO "EQUALS" within groups. No intellectual "equals", no physical "equals", no emotional "equals". The most capable in reasoning/thinking/acting rise to the top and control the rest. They build for themselves a power _base_ and structure beneath it to keep the others in place. Societies are groups of people doing the same things for the same purposes under the guidance and influence of a leadership. The leadership recognizes human nature for what it is and exploits it in various ways in order to keep society together and moving along.
The chief concerns of the human being are food and shelter. After that its sex. Once food and shelter become predictable and easily obtained, sexual activity increases. With an increase in sexual activity, the population of the group begins growing. But now there's spare time during the day. Food and shelter are easily obtained, remember. What do group members fill their spare time with? Well, its not always with sex! This is how groups develop cultures. They do certain things according to certain standardized beliefs, and those beliefs are set forth by the leadership. The leaders themselves may not believe in any of the beliefs, but they'll act like they do! The beliefs are some of the "glue" which hold the society of the group together. Everyone must do and think in more or less the same way, or the society ends. But another type of "glue" which holds society together is FORCE. Leaders must always employ force in the form of taboos _link_ed with punishment in order to keep the group together and keep its society/culture firm. Why? Because ultimately, ALL human beings are individuals motivated by their own desires, likes, and dislikes. You can't have a bunch of individuals all trying to realize their own personal desires, likes, and dislikes because that would mean there can be no society!! So, each individual must be FORCED to place his/her desires, likes, and dislikes second to the function of the society and culture. All successful leaders realise this fact. And how is this done? By threats, taboos, laws, regulations, and through developing mythologies...ALL of which are backed up by FORCE which brings unpleasant consiquences to anyone who goes beyond them or breaks them.
So, "religion" does not spawn heirarchies. Hierarchies spawn religions for the same reason they spawn laws and regulations and moral taboos.
You are showing your own insane programming by trying to state that religion ( a creation of the human intellect ) controls its creator! No religion ever controlled human beings. Human beings always create and then control/manipulate their religions.
I strongly suggest that you read my other posts in this forum before you answer me. If you want an intellectual discussion, I'll give you one. But you will have to do better than what you've said in your original post.

On your comment of beliefs, which were designed to control the masses? What do you mean by these? Pointing out the many religions? If yes, then yes I do believe all belief systems that are implemented on the population are meant to steer them like sheep into a desired path.
Second, my country (Canada) yes, and I do not believe any country has so far a good type of government of any kind. I’d rather support a concept as Tribalism. There is one thing I do believe, it is : “power corrupts, absolute power corrupts absolutely” - Lord Acton. If you truly wish to see the world as it should be seen, read a book called Ishmael by Daniel Quinn. His philosophy and look on our world are grand and so well thought out. (more on his concepts later)
Enlightened governments? Two words that don’t belong together. If we are to have a true revolution in order to have a sustainable future, we require an enlightened population, because the politicians are the last one to get ‘’it’’ they don’t require to because the population doesn’t get it. Our politicians represent the masses, look at Bush? I don’t say we did better with re-electing Harper in Canada, after we supposedly had a green conscience in the past few months and then we elect the only politician without a very de_script_ive environmental plan.
Also, our western governments are far from being in control, the corporations are in control and also, our way of life in developed country, depends on the destruction and downfall of the third world. But our society is on an intellectual downfall where we consume and gather material belongings in order to fill a void instead of filling ourselves with knowledge and taking part in the community which is much more gratifying and moves things in a better path. The ‘’American’’ way of life is everyone to a house and plugged on a television, joined with the nasty idea that everyone in the world should live this way, which would be utterly impossible to accomplish unless we have several planets. If you want to look into this, look up the author Morris Berman (two of who’s books are ‘’dark ages America” and “twilight of American culture”) Quite the eye openers.
Also, for our sick ways of consumption I suggest www.storyofstuff.com
On your third point, yes this is what I want to change in the population of this planet. Most of the population seems to go by the assumption that the world belongs to man instead of man belonging to the world. This is, and you cannot refute, a religious point of view. But, if you read Ishmael, you’ll see it was born from religion, but it was because it was miss interpreted. We need to abolish this thought, along with the fact that evolution reached an end with us? Why would life evolve for millions of years on this planet to stop at humans? We are the first conscious beings on this world, but certainly not the last, if we can manage not exterminate ourselves.
“which of the two ( religious mythological nonsense or present-day materialist mythological nonsense ) are worse and have the most potential for destruction? “ Ok, I know our consumption ways are really bad, but if we call ourselves civilized people and religion says do no harm onto others, how come so many people have died in the name of god? I’m sorry but this concept is ridiculous, from the black plague to the crusades to the burning of witches. Religion did use people in order to advance its own agenda. Oh right, I missed the conquering of the western world by the church, or then again the fact that Bush says god wants to purify the middle east.

On your fourth argument yes it is quite sick to see the path we are heading for. But it’s not always been like this...but it is rapidly growing so. The fact is there is no ONE right way to live, but US interest and economic system requires everyone to live the same. I would really really love for you to read Ishmael, and see the concepts behind it. He doesn’t throw out the idea of god, but does say that the bible was severely miss interpreted and he does explain how it should be seen.
If there truly was a vision and mindset that could make this world sustainable and functional, it his rational way to go through human history and show us the wrong steps we’ve taken and how a change of mind in the population could actually change things. There nothing that say we have to keep going this way, we are on a plain that is crashing, it’s time for a new vision.
I like your point on societies and how everyone has to follow its path since it wouldn’t be a society without it. That’s the point, humans weren’t meant to live in civilization our true way to live is Tribalism and I’m not talking about what we call ‘’savages’’ but more like an equality and the fact that all the individuals of the tribe must give something to it in order to prosper within it.

I am not totally against the views of religion, the concepts behind it ( like the 10 commandments) are good in theory, but I don’t like the fact that many religious people, I’ve heard it from several people, think that it is alright if we destroy our planet, Jesus promised us a new earth. That is completely idiotic and I see it as lazy way to say : don’t worry all in all this life is only a test and we can truly live in heaven, so just waste your time here and be quiet while you wait for heaven. The other thing I don’t like about religion is the fact that ignorance is worshipped, you don’t need to know much since your faith lets you explain anything even thought sometimes it makes no sense at all.
As for Zeitgeist, I like it for the sole fact that it opens people’s eyes to the fact that we are controlled by the few of this world. We must stop being guided like sheep by people that only serve their own selfish greed, and that greed is helping them and a few rich people of the America’s but its destroying everything else in the world while they ravage anything that stands in their way. I will say that Zeitgeist took the wrong approach to the subject and the one true thing you cannot debate is religion. If you do debate religion, people get quickly mad and for that reason everyone is discrediting Zeitgeist.
If you truly wish to have a future for your kids and the next generation, to turn our “intelligent” race on a path to sustainability and equal rights for the masses, then read Ishmael and understand the complete rational and intelligent reasoning of Daniel Quinn and his vision for an actual functional human society. I say society because if we want to have a next generation we must leap beyond civilization.
I call for a rise in intellectual development because we truly are in a decline; we require to see things with eyes unclouded by “mother culture” which is what the reasoning of Quinn will give you. It will remove the veil, but it’s only the first picture of it, at least it is a start.

Geekto would ask you to read my responses carefully over and decide who the "idiot" is but instead of doing that and wasting more of your time discussing anything intellectual with him you should stop immediately. I've gone over many aspects of human behavior and the roles of life changes forces in peoples lives and he continues to pretend like human nature is all knowing and the cause of everything wrong. Save some time and do something worth while like, taking a shit. Anything is better then refuting this garbage nonsensical fool.